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Looking for OC_DAV
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| Ftoomsh | Date: Friday, 19/April/2013, 11:31 PM | Message # 11 |
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Group: Modders
Messages: 124
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| Thank you Nowy, that is a very comprehensive reply. Your suggestions are very good. I will use them where I can. To include your suggestions in my rebalancing Mod of Dav's Mod they would have to meet the following criteria;
(1) They would have to be possible in the game engine.
(2) They would have to be consistent with game balance.
I think we have to remember a few things here. The first thing is that I am balancing an RTS game with 21 nations in it. OC Mod is an RTS (Real Time Strategy) game. In RTS, nations grow from a tiny base (18 peasants) and add economic and then military power. This is distinct from a battlefield game like the games that Master of the Field play. A battlefield game does not model the economy and growth from a tiny base. A battlefield game just models battles in the field. As such a battlefield game can be more historically accurate. It is appropriate to have higher standards of historical accuracy for a battlefield mod. An RTS mod however, has different considerations. Historical accuracy has to be sacrificed a bit more to to make the RTS playable and balanced. After all, an RTS is more artificial than a battlefield game. Because it is trying to model more complexities, both economy and military, it actually has to make more simplifications. This makes it more artificial.
Personally, I prefer RTS to battlefield games but each person will have their preference. I admit that RTS is more artificial and stylised but I like the dynamics and challenges of growing the economy and the military and then fighting battles as well.
In terms of nations, a 21 nation game where random nation is used a lot to get variety in 1v1 games, the nations have to be reasonably balanced or some nations are not worth playing. This balance is achieved asymmetrically to add interest. They have different units and capabilities and different phases of the game where they are at their best.
I should add that for me to mod something is has to be in my skill range. I can't add new buildings because I can't do graphics in the Cossacks engine and I am not an artist in any case.
Message edited by Ftoomsh - Friday, 19/April/2013, 11:44 PM |
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| Nowy | Date: Thursday, 25/April/2013, 10:46 AM | Message # 12 |
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Marquis
Group: Users
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| Historical based Real Time Strategy and Battlefield games should include properly chosen historical aspects. Both these games are artificial, because real history can not be implemented into the game. There always are some simplifications in the games.
RTS game normally include economy, power build and warfare strategies. Then it also include battlefield tactics. When historical aspects are incorrect implemented then it can spoil gameplay and fun. Especially for these players which know something about history.
These mean that historical based RTS games should include correctly represented main historical aspects.
Any 21 nations can not get equal power. That was impossible in 17-18cc and still is not possible today. Then nation balance in historical based game can not include such cases that minor power without any allies help could win the war against major power.
When all 21 nations in the game get similar power and differences between nations are only in few national buildings, few strangely chosen units with badly chosen statistics, and strange capabilities, then all these 21 nations represent only clones warfare.
These do not give desirable variety or diversity in real time strategy. All these nations in warfare strategy sense became almost the same, they include only few different graphical things, few different units which in historical sense are quite strange. Few different units badly represented in the game never help fix gameplay balance.
Therefore RTS game or your OC mod should include:
1. Well chosen and well represented units, and buildings.
2. Proper units statistics, skills, abilities. Stamina and morale effects also will be well come.
3. Properly represented formation strength, armament and tactics based on historical facts.
4. Strategies for each nation tiers levelled as great land powers, great naval powers, emergent nations, insurgent nations and minor nations.
There were not equal powers in 17-18cc.
5. Improved economy, warfare and victory conditions which can better stick with period which was represented in the game.
You want to fix nations' balance and you probably plan change units statistics. Fine, but you could include proper historical aspects, mean include these which were characteristic for that times and are realistic according to historical facts.
There are many elements worthy to fix.
In majority these things would have to be possible in the game engine I suppose.
They would have to be consistent with game balance and characteristic historical aspects.
Message edited by Nowy - Thursday, 25/April/2013, 1:17 PM |
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| EbelAngel | Date: Thursday, 15/August/2013, 1:57 AM | Message # 13 |
 Site Administrator
Group: Administrators
Messages: 996
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| Quote (Ftoomsh) I would like to get in contact with OC_Davout who created Cossacks OC Mod. Can anyone put me in contact with him? I know his name but cannot trace him.
Sent you a mail with OC Davouts email adress that works. Bit late eh , but well, all good things come to those who have patience... 
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| Nowy | Date: Thursday, 15/August/2013, 3:20 PM | Message # 14 |
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Marquis
Group: Users
Messages: 320
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| Hmm, I forgot that here was quite fine discussion about C1 mods and historical aspects in the RTS games.
Strangely it was raised in thread which was tilted as "Looking for OC DAV (Creator of OC Mod).
This discussion started here with my message # 4 and was continued to message # 12.
It would be good cast that debate in other thread with more recognizable name.
Then viewers on this forum could easier find that debate. Maybe somebody would like to continue that matters too.
EbelAngel can you extract this discussion and put it in other thread under name "Historical aspects in C1 mods".
Message edited by Nowy - Thursday, 15/August/2013, 3:23 PM |
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