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Forum » American Conquest » Modding » Calling all Modders (Combined Project)
Calling all Modders
FtoomshDate: Friday, 30/August/2013, 2:45 AM | Message # 1
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I have added a topic to C1 Modding called Game Project - Developing a Universal Mod. This post is really meant for all modders to read and comment on but I put it in the C1 modding forum to keep all replies in one place.

The fact that it is in the C1 Modding forum does not in any way imply that I think the C1 engine would be the best engine for the proposed project. The issue of the best engine for the modding project is still an open question.


Message edited by Ftoomsh - Friday, 30/August/2013, 2:46 AM
 
MarshalAndreDate: Monday, 02/September/2013, 0:33 AM | Message # 2
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What exactly is this mod going to be based on?  I have been experimenting with blender and so far I have been able to make a building of sorts, but I don't really know how to place it into acfb.  If you are talking about C1, then maybe I'll take that and use it to learn.  But to be honest I think acfb has a bit more to build on allowing for more content, just my two cents.
Me
 
FtoomshDate: Monday, 02/September/2013, 7:59 AM | Message # 3
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Quote (MarshalAndre)
What exactly is this mod going to be based on?

The question of what engine this mod would be based on is left open at this point. In broad terms, it would be necessary first to outline the scope and general requirements of the mod project. "Scoping" a project is the creative and visionary first step. It refers to how big the project will be and how many features it will have. You can think of it initially as a wish list. A first wish list can even contain seemingly impossible or contradictory elements. Later on, it can be pared down to the possible. You look at the scoping wish list even before paring it down to the possible and ask a key question:

"Which engine when modified could most likely deliver more of this wish list than any other engine?"

My scoping wish list bears re-stating. It does reflect my bias for big, strategic but still playable games. Remember, don't at this stage invoke judgements of "that's impossible". It's totally a wish list initially and might be far from possible.

1. Large unit limits of 64,000 (army of 4 corps) per player.
2. At least 4 players in online multiplayer games.
3. Realistic sight and action ranges.
4. 100% military realism for all units including morale, fatigue, supply weapons and fighting methods.
5. Large maps equal to an operational area or theatre of 10,000 meters by 10,000 meters.
6. Two speed real-time engine in strategic time and tactical time.
7. Mobilisation, formation movements and military works in strategic time. 1 minute of player time = 1 hour elapsing in game world.
8. Military engagements occur in real time. 1 minute of player time = 1 minute elapsing in game world.
9. Engine algorithm controls switching between strategic time and tactical time.
10. This switching is based on egagement of significant forces as they come into "action range" which is maximum (not effective) cannon fire range.
11. All methods of fighting and military works of the era to be possible (trenching, undermining to blow walls and positions, gabions, fleches, firing from parapets, escalare ie. ladders to climb walls, tank traps etc. whatever is appropriate to the era.
12. All eras modded from medieval to WW2.
13. No intention for all games to cover all eras. Best play would probably ensue from games covering one or at most two eras.
14. Support 3 game styles: Battlefield , Mobilisation, and RTS.

Battlefield = Complete armies pre-positioned on a battlefield usually out of action range and with some pre-engagment manouvres possible.
Mobilisation = Only forward elements on the strategic map. These must secure deployment points (near map edges) to allow pre-determined number of reinforcements to arrive from off-map at a scripted rate. Much more scouting, taking of stratgic points and forward positioning must occur probably even before major battlefield engagements.
RTS = Well, C1 or C2 type games. We know what RTS is.

Okay, now all of this is clearly not possible. Unless anyone has built a two-speed time engine or thinks they can mod an existing engine to two speeds (highly improbable) we are stuck with a one speed time engine.

Given what I am scoping, then we are looking for the engine which gives;

(A) The highest unit count possible. And a menu system to allow games with lower unit caps than the maximum.
(B) Highest realism factor possible. Realistic action, morale, fatigue, supply, weapons and fighting methods. And menus for choices.
© Landsacape deformable by works if possible. (Trenching, tunnelling, fencing, walling, clearing trees for clear fire and so on).
(D) Largest maps possible.
(E) Most flexibility for incorporating pre-existing quality modding work; designs, units, buildings for all eras medieval to WW2.

What I am envisaging is one universal mod which covers all eras, medieval to WW2, and 3 game style by menu selection namely Battlefield, Mobilisation and RTS. To reiterate it is not suggested that all games proceed through all eras. That would be far from most people's tastes.

This project though perhaps ambitious coild  draw all modders and all gamers back to one mod project which caters to all tastes via extensive menu selections. It could re-unite the modding and playing community in a sense. Currently, we tend to be dispersed through different game models.
 
MarshalAndreDate: Monday, 02/September/2013, 9:38 PM | Message # 4
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Ok, I have a little question, have you played the Napoleonic mod from the Hawks site?  A multiplayer game that is.  If not then I would recommend you download it and we can play it using gameranger and there you might get a feel for what can be done through that particular engine.  The reason why I suggest this is because it has been modded in some ways as you have mentioned.  To be honest I see acfb as the best engine unless you wish to mod CII.  However, it has its limitations in map size.  ACFB has large maps, and that can be changed in some ways as well like 3x3 size maps to give a fit between sizes.  Also the game can be patched to allow for it to register more ram easily and without much headache.  

As for the era, oh gosh, where do I start.  Please don't try to cover so much history in one game as it takes away from everything, unless you make the game file so big and put so much time effort and a decade of life that could it be better spent.  If you cover that much then you take away the feel and detail from a specific era.  Try an AoE approach, cover closely related eras together that don't detract from each other but instead compliment each other.  As for the speed at which the game plays try using frame count by adding more frames that the system has to go through in order to make it run at a more realistic speed.  Two speed game sounds impossible all right, but I don't actually understand you fully, I think.  Maybe you can farther enlighten me on what you're trying to implement.  

As for an era, may I suggest what I wish?  The War of Austrian Succession.  That is what I plan to make my mod but I am more than willing to create a team and work on it or join a team and save my mod for a later time.  I would rather work as a team and work with what ever it is that you are trying to do to gain experience in programming so that I can use it later in life when I go out into the workforce.

Me
 
ab_99Date: Monday, 02/September/2013, 11:20 PM | Message # 5
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Quote (MarshalAndre)
I have been experimenting with blender and so far I have been able to make a building of sorts, but I don't really know how to place it into acfb.

1. you can not put your model in afbc?

2. You can change the palette for afbc? Extend the range of blue and white.

Added (02/September/2013, 11:20 PM)
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Quote (MarshalAndre)
Also the game can be patched to allow for it to register more ram easily and without much headache.
 what do you mean?
 
MarshalAndreDate: Tuesday, 03/September/2013, 2:02 AM | Message # 6
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Quote (ab_99)
Also the game can be patched to allow for it to register more ram easily and without much headache. what do you mean?
What I mean is is that it was't built for 64 bit systems, so with the patch it can utilize more Ram allowing it to run on a 64bit system.  The only problem is that acfb with the patch can only utilize up to 7~8 GB of RAM, so if you had say 16 GB then it would only use 7~8 GB of it. That's actually just fine as I don't know of a program that uses more than 8 GB anyways.

Quote (ab_99)
1. you can not put your model in afbc? 2. You can change the palette for afbc? Extend the range of blue and white.
I don't know what to do to place it in game.  And am I supposed to render it to bmp image or something?

Me

Added (03/September/2013, 2:02 AM)
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Quote (ab_99)
Also the game can be patched to allow for it to register more ram easily and without much headache. what do you mean?
What I mean is is that it was't built for 64 bit systems, so with the patch it can utilize more Ram allowing it to run on a 64bit system.  The only problem is that acfb with the patch can only utilize up to 7~8 GB of RAM, so if you had say 16 GB then it would only use 7~8 GB of it. That's actually just fine as I don't know of a program that uses more than 8 GB anyways.

Quote (ab_99)
1. you can not put your model in afbc? 2. You can change the palette for afbc? Extend the range of blue and white.
I don't know what to do to place it in game.  And am I supposed to render it to bmp image or something?

Me
 
ab_99Date: Tuesday, 03/September/2013, 2:14 PM | Message # 7
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acquainted with the theory here:

http://swordandarrow.ucoz.com/index/adding_a_new_unit_to_the_game/0-31

then you can ask questions smile

Quote (MarshalAndre)
What I mean is is that it was't built for 64 bit systems, so with the patch it can utilize more Ram allowing it to run on a 64bit system.

Is this possible without altering the game engine?
such a patch exists?


Message edited by ab_99 - Tuesday, 03/September/2013, 2:15 PM
 
MarshalDate: Thursday, 05/September/2013, 3:35 AM | Message # 8
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I am currently waiting for a friend to get it for me as I personally don't have it.  Once I find out if it works I'll let you know and see if I can make it available to you.
Me


1st Prince de Wagram, 1st Duc de Valangin, 1st Sovereign Prince de Neuchatel, Marshal of France, Marshal Louis Alexandre Berthier
 
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